Maybe just the first two...
How about “Beat me, whip me, make me write bad grammar in other languages.”
Am currently torturing self with passato remoto (the past absolute) in Italian. This is the lesson I skipped back in September – 8 September to be exact, as I date all my written activities.
Who the hell knows why I do these things.
Sono una masochista gramatica. I am a grammar masochist, apparently.
I figured I could recognize itnine out of 10 two out of 10 times in literature, thanks to Luigi's Sicilian Seduction last Spring. However, conjugating this stuff is like my body trying to pull off this yoga pose:
My brain is twisted bendy but holy hell is still limited to only certain people tricks. However close I may be to finally feeling my toes in my hair during a yoga pose is probably as close as I'll ever get to full fluency, but it's the practice and the doing that I crave.
A lesson I have learned over the last two years of my foray into this interesting and musical language is that everything comes with time. They say learning a new language is like growing a new head. You can’t translate everything literally into your mother tongue, nor can you think in your own language and cultural paradigms.
Every oral adventure in my upper-intermediate intensive last fall seemed to be just what I needed at that stage in my new head’s development. It was as if my lovely Italian teacher was inside my new Italian head (which has brain and language skills of a 10-year-old at best) guiding the pieces into place.
Did we cover passato remoto in those 70 hours of “Ehi! In italiano – non usate inglese qui!” (Hey, in Italian - no using English here!)?
Nah – and at the time it didn’t seem important. Plus yours truly was begging to be slapped around by congiuntivo (subjunctive) and condizionale (conditional) – and it hurt so. Damned. Good.
Grazie Signora, posso avere un’altra? Thank you ma’am, can I have another?
Is passato remoto going to save lives and keep the mission from failing now? Nope. I've even seen on-line debates over the utility of this tense in modern spoken Italian; it differs region by region, as do dialects.
But the lesson is well-timed being the book I found in a 2 Euro discount bin that I’m piano-piano (s-l-o-ow-l-y) working my way through is rife with passato remoto.
I’m seeing how this tense “way back in the day” portrays a Palestinian woman’s struggle in the 30s, 40s, 50s (that’s as far as I’ve gotten). Recognizing the tense has added intensity and dimension to the images that are conjured of the orange groves, the piles of books she read, the things her father was saying to her as she struggled against what women were “expected” to do during her turbulent time on the planet. Her thoughts and experiences are immortalized in this project that was written as she died.
Sure I’ve been working on the book for 6 weeks. No rush. I savor a few pages, set it down and pick it up a day or two later.
The passato remotobeatings exercises of the last few days also made me realize that I don’t have to torture myself with every conjugation, use it in my own e-mails or writings. I’m sure my written spewings in Italiano are already torture enough for those reading them anyway.
The fact that I’ve come this far makes the pain all at once worth it and quite enjoyable.
Il dolore e` inevitabile. La sofferenza, opzionale. (Pain is inevitable. Suffering, optional.) Anonymous.
How about “Beat me, whip me, make me write bad grammar in other languages.”
Am currently torturing self with passato remoto (the past absolute) in Italian. This is the lesson I skipped back in September – 8 September to be exact, as I date all my written activities.
Who the hell knows why I do these things.
Sono una masochista gramatica. I am a grammar masochist, apparently.
I figured I could recognize it
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| Photo & Blog Source |
A lesson I have learned over the last two years of my foray into this interesting and musical language is that everything comes with time. They say learning a new language is like growing a new head. You can’t translate everything literally into your mother tongue, nor can you think in your own language and cultural paradigms.
Every oral adventure in my upper-intermediate intensive last fall seemed to be just what I needed at that stage in my new head’s development. It was as if my lovely Italian teacher was inside my new Italian head (which has brain and language skills of a 10-year-old at best) guiding the pieces into place.
Did we cover passato remoto in those 70 hours of “Ehi! In italiano – non usate inglese qui!” (Hey, in Italian - no using English here!)?
Nah – and at the time it didn’t seem important. Plus yours truly was begging to be slapped around by congiuntivo (subjunctive) and condizionale (conditional) – and it hurt so. Damned. Good.
Grazie Signora, posso avere un’altra? Thank you ma’am, can I have another?
Is passato remoto going to save lives and keep the mission from failing now? Nope. I've even seen on-line debates over the utility of this tense in modern spoken Italian; it differs region by region, as do dialects.
But the lesson is well-timed being the book I found in a 2 Euro discount bin that I’m piano-piano (s-l-o-ow-l-y) working my way through is rife with passato remoto.
I’m seeing how this tense “way back in the day” portrays a Palestinian woman’s struggle in the 30s, 40s, 50s (that’s as far as I’ve gotten). Recognizing the tense has added intensity and dimension to the images that are conjured of the orange groves, the piles of books she read, the things her father was saying to her as she struggled against what women were “expected” to do during her turbulent time on the planet. Her thoughts and experiences are immortalized in this project that was written as she died.Sure I’ve been working on the book for 6 weeks. No rush. I savor a few pages, set it down and pick it up a day or two later.
The passato remoto
The fact that I’ve come this far makes the pain all at once worth it and quite enjoyable.
Il dolore e` inevitabile. La sofferenza, opzionale. (Pain is inevitable. Suffering, optional.) Anonymous.
I'm getting to grips with Costa Rican Spanish...three falls or a knockout to decide the contest...
ReplyDeleteLuckily, experience of getting to grips with French has taught me that the essential thing is to get to grips with the culture..and the language follows.
Not easily, but it makes more sense than going in blind with lessons and a dictionary.
@Fly - You are so correct. I believe learning the language and the culture go hand-in-hand - having to understand one to understand the other. You remember more the things you had to use, and screwed up (my most popular way of learning) while you're experiencing living abroad. I remember that an eggplant is female the rest of my life just from the way the old woman in the market corrected me, "unA?" as in "you mean 1/one, feminine vegetable???" Si.
ReplyDelete"No pain, no gain" eh? Also don't u find that what is toughest for us to accomplish eggs us on to accomplish it? and once done its all great... kinda like feeling that burn as u peak at that cardio, huh? at least that's how it is for me..
ReplyDeleteI tried googling the book u r reading is the English version called " the wind in my hair"?
ReplyDeleteI think for us stubborn gals, yes. My 2nd favorite quote from GI Jane, "The more they f*** with me the more I want to gut it out!"
ReplyDeleteYes - That was what drew me to the cover - I liked the title of the book which translates to "With the Wind in my Hair" and was sucked in as soon as I opened it, so I bought it.
It was originally written with Laura Maritano & Elisabetta Donini to help Salwa recount her memoirs. At the time she lived in Milan, where Salwa moved with her husband from Vienna but it has been translated into English and I'm betting it would be a good read!
I'm at the part of the book where she is 18 finally convinced her dad to let her leave Jaffa and go to Kuwait to go to college and live with her brothers who were extreme Ba'ath party activists. There were many things I never understood about the Palestinian-Israeli situation and probably still didn't get it as I walked around Jaffa a few years ago.
It is so amazing to me that it took learning another language and digging through a discount bin at Mel Books in Florence to increase my awareness of another culture. And not even sure I would have even picked the book up had I seen it in English without a recommendation or a really good 'flip through.' Cluelessly staring at that bin of books in Italian wondering what I could possibly even attempt to read, ending up with this book, is one of those experiences that has brought home all the 'awesomeness' that comes with immersing yourself in something you love - for as long as you can. Good stuff.
Let me know what you think of the book! If you're into books from the women's perspective who've struggled against oppression, you'll like this book. It's got an extensive bibliography in the back as well. "Reading Lolita in Tehran" is another all time favorite on the subject too.
You are truly amazing in your quest for learning Italian....Brava! My husband just decided that he wanted to learn it, too (mind you, we have been married for 27 years and he has been around spoken Italian for all that time...but just NOW he has decided to try to learn it...), but he keeps trying to translate everything back to English and I tell him that he shouldn't do that because it stunts him. I am glad that you have gotten past that hurdle...you are doing great with all you've learned. Are you dreaming in Italian yet? And by the way, I had to buy an Italian grammar book to learn the Italian parts of speech because I had no idea what tense I was using when I spoke...it would just come out. But now that I have to explain it to my husband, I need the proper guidance!!
ReplyDeleteI have no doubt that you will conquer the passato remoto! The book that you're reading sounds very interesting. I need to branch out in my reading from time to time, and this might be a good book for me to explore. Thanks.
ReplyDelete@Barbara - Grazie tanto! I don't know about amazing - just stubborn and very passionate about it. I had one dream in Italian and even in that I was still aware that I was making mistakes. But hey - if you don't make them, you don't learn.
ReplyDeleteHow cool your husband wants to learn! You already know I swear by Rosetta Stone as a base, Michelle Thomas in the car, movies with subtitles and music. I like Barron's Italian Verb Workbook to learn the tenses. Also on-line wordreference.com (which I only found a year ago) has a conjugator that lists all the forms nicely.
Funny, I forgot the names for the tenses in English! Subjunctive? Boh?! I was learning parts of English grammar all over again!
In bocca al lupo!
Hi Michele - Thank you! I usually have my nose in 3 or 4 books at once and switch off depending on my mood (and flighty attention span). I just finished Bill Bryson's "Neither Here Nor There" and Sergio Esposito's "Passion on the Vine" (very food and Italy intensive, which you may enjoy) and am finishing up Eric Weiner's "Geography of Bliss" - a hysterical travel read (non-fiction) if you like those and need a giggle. Have a great weekend!
ReplyDeleteOMFG, I READ LOLITA IN TEHRAN! One of my daughters gave it to me ..I will definitely get that Salwa book!.
ReplyDeleteSweet - I'd love to hear your thoughts on it - hopefully I'll finish it in the next few weeks. Can't wait to go back and dig through the bins again. Ooh - Maybe I'll start posting "Bargain Bin Book Reviews" from the "Bottom of the Barrel!" Or maybe not.
ReplyDeleteLolita's strength is what was so amazing!. Her tenacity, such a well written book.. She would make any woman proud... Just goes to show u that we are definitely the stronger and smarter sex... I wish she would write another... Her heart must ache at times living here in the u.s. and her family and friends back in her homeland.
ReplyDeleteCrissy - Have you ever read "The Woman Warrior" by Maxine Hong Kingston? It was required reading for an International Business Course when I was in undergrad. Poignant story of a woman trying to find her way between Chinese traditions imposed by her family and fitting in with American culture. It was quite a while ago when I read it, but I'm thinking it took place in San Francisco. (Bonus: It was a Trivial Pursuit question in the 10th anniversary addition that scored my team a win in grad school - no one could believe I knew the answer "Maxine Hong Kingston")
ReplyDeleteI forgot - Azar Nafisi DID write another book but I haven't read it. It's called "Things I've Been Silent about" - it's about her growing up in Iran.
ReplyDeletebtw, my mom's cousin wrote "Clay Walls'
ReplyDeletehttp://www.amazon.com/Clay-Walls-Kim-Ronyoung/dp/1877946788
Ronyoung is a pen name.. the book is similar to Joy Luck Club..omg, I learned things about my mother's side of the family that I never knew... She wrote this back in the late 70's. she died of cancer shortly after writing it.